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Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

DanielMuff — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 18:55:32 GMT

O_Brien:

Completely smashed? I beg to differ.

Beg all you want. I challenge you to refute what I've said in this thread.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Daniel James Sanchez — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 16:48:22 GMT

Snowflake:

I remember when this thread started and a mod threatened to graveyard it.

Not threatened; he did graveyard it.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Jon Irenicus — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 16:44:06 GMT

Yes, completely.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Sieben — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 12:56:41 GMT

I remember when this thread started and a mod threatened to graveyard it. At the time, I thought everything would be okay. I was wrong.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

O_Brien — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 12:53:43 GMT

Completely smashed? I beg to differ.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

jtucker — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 12:47:31 GMT

Yeah, this guy joined solely for the purpose of engaging in troll-like behavior. On this one, he has been completely smashed but it wasted lots of time. He is not banned yet. Maybe he will learn something here and have a change of heart.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

nirgrahamUK — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 11:52:05 GMT

it seems like Marx disagreed. he does so explicitly.

http://mises.org/Community/forums/p/11853/266865.aspx#266865

maybe its empty rhetoric, but who knows.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Andrew Cain — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:20:55 GMT

nirgrahamUK:

what made you think that was an issue of dispute?

Marx's equation: people to hate are, the bourgeois =capitalists=individualists=egoists=jews.

so the Jews are in there, in the hating.synonymous as they are with all that stuff Marx hates and is emancipated from.

its nutz, but its not my insanity, its Marx's. isnt it?

But not all jews are bourgeois. There are jews who are bourgeois and thus their superstructure is one of a bourgeois.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Bostwick — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:18:40 GMT

Jonathan M. F. Catalán:
Rothbard is in the wrong in this case.

No way!

He is correct in how he describes the popular holocaust history.

Its indisputable that the holocaust has been blamed on "doctrines of racial superiority and inferiority" and that link has been used to suppress of any talk of racial differences, no matter how scientific.

And he is correct when the points out why that blame is misplaced.

"In point of fact, however, it should be clear that Hitler and the Nazis did not persecute Jews because they believed Jews to be inferior in intelligence."

Or in other words, the holocaust is not linked with racial superiority. It should be noted that in order to maintain the holocaust as racism myth, the non-jewish victims of the holocaust are continually downplayed.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

nirgrahamUK — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:18:10 GMT

Laughing Man:
It is not like jews are some separate system of thought from bourgeois.

what made you think that was an issue of dispute?

Marx's equation: people to hate are, the bourgeois =capitalists=individualists=egoists=jews.

so the Jews are in there, in the hating.synonymous as they are with all that stuff Marx hates and is emancipated from.

its nutz, but its not my insanity, its Marx's. isnt it?

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Andrew Cain — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:10:44 GMT

nirgrahamUK:
are you telling me that Marx did not hate the bourgeoisand did not incite socialists/proles to hate the bourgeois?

I'm telling you that a consciousness is determined by the forces of production. Therefore there is only the bourgeois and the proletariat. It is not like jews are some separate system of thought from bourgeois.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

nirgrahamUK — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 03:40:15 GMT

Laughing Man:
He was not against jews anymore then he was against bourgeois thought.

are you telling me that Marx did not hate the bourgeoisand did not incite socialists/proles to hate the bourgeois?

i dont know what you are telling me

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Andrew Cain — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 03:27:59 GMT

nirgrahamUK:

I dont get it laughingman. yes, he is against egotism. this doesnt mean he isnt against jews. in fact. it supports he was against jews. since he spells out in his mind that capitalits=individualists=egoists=jews.

they all have to be emancipated from their jewishness (like Marx was), or else they are enemies of the proletariat (non-jews)

That goes without saying for all bourgeois. He was not against jews anymore then he was against bourgeois thought.

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

nirgrahamUK — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:35:23 GMT

Laughing Man:
If you read that piece, it is an assault on egotism. He also attacks the Declaration of the Rights of Man and Citizens for establishing basic rights such as property, liberty, security and equality. Property & liberty are based on egotism.

I dont get it laughingman. yes, he is against egotism. this doesnt mean he isnt against jews. in fact. it supports he was against jews. since he spells out in his mind that capitalits=individualists=egoists=jews.

they all have to be emancipated from their jewishness (like Marx was), or else they are enemies of the proletariat (non-jews)

Re: Oh no he didn't! Rothbard on Holocaust

Edmund Carlyle — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 01:29:36 GMT

Jews were perceived to be inferior just because

It was not 'just because', as though millions of social democrats woke up one day and decided that they disliked jews. Historically it had to do with economic and religious factors, justificationally it had to do with elaborate (if absurd) racial theories relating to heredity of character, social dispositions and genotype quasi-nationalism. The Nazis had reasons which, while stupid, were no more stupid than the majority of reasons people believe in God or Obama.