Current Events

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Willy Truth — Fri, 12 Apr 2013 19:39:57 GMT

This article claims that a few background checks in CO actually prevented violent felons from getting guns. http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/1c7qwj/background_checks_in_colorado_stop_38_from_buying/

Assuming that this is actually true, what are some good arguments against background checks?

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

fakename — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 16:16:38 GMT

I've been down the same road as you it seems. I used Brasil as an example as to how you can have very strict gun laws and it doesn't stop wack jobs from getting them. One of the responses I received was something along the lines of how they have a different culture and that they are poor, so it isn't fair to compare the USA to Brasil and that it makes more sense to compare the USA to Canada. I had to push my brain back through my ears after I read that one.

You should ask them how culture or poverty makes brazilians more violent. Seriously, how does celebrating carnival, wearing bikinis and going to the beach make people more violent and how does being poor make one turn to a life of crime? Clearly, until they can explain the exact connection between crime and these other things, their responses are much like the "brawndo" scene from Idiocracy.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Torsten — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 15:41:58 GMT

Hell, last time I checked, in my city I'm not even allowed to carry PEPPER SPRAY to defend myself.

That seems to be the following on the agenda, after guns are banned. Commonly this is used to chase away muggers and would be rapists.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

jmorris84 — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 03:16:20 GMT

Vanitas Nomen:
I've gotten into a few 'debates' regarding gun ownership lately. Seems to be the left argument boils down to less guns equals less gun related murders. Not only is this demonstrably false(at least in the unilateral sense) but it misses the point, that being that we do not simply want less gun-related homocides, but less violent crimes in general. Point to the Soviet Union as an example; strict gun control compared to the US, far higher murder rate. Or point to the fact that in the middle ages, before guns were invented, the murder rate was astronomically higher. Not only were there less people, but less efficient ways to kill them -- and they still were butchering one another.

I've been down the same road as you it seems. I used Brasil as an example as to how you can have very strict gun laws and it doesn't stop wack jobs from getting them. One of the responses I received was something along the lines of how they have a different culture and that they are poor, so it isn't fair to compare the USA to Brasil and that it makes more sense to compare the USA to Canada. I had to push my brain back through my ears after I read that one.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Vanitas Nomen — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 00:52:52 GMT

I've gotten into a few 'debates' regarding gun ownership lately. Seems to be the left argument boils down to less guns equals less gun related murders. Not only is this demonstrably false(at least in the unilateral sense) but it misses the point, that being that we do not simply want less gun-related homocides, but less violent crimes in general. Point to the Soviet Union as an example; strict gun control compared to the US, far higher murder rate. Or point to the fact that in the middle ages, before guns were invented, the murder rate was astronomically higher. Not only were there less people, but less efficient ways to kill them -- and they still were butchering one another.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

fountainhead — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 00:04:40 GMT

Prime, don't tempt them. They may just call for banning all of them. :P

Hell, last time I checked, in my city I'm not even allowed to carry PEPPER SPRAY to defend myself.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Blargg — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 00:02:36 GMT

Is there a hidden cause, that of the people who carry guns being in greater danger and therefore choosing to carry a gun? Or some other hidden cause for a person wanting to carry a gun and that person getting shot at more than other people.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Prime — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 00:01:13 GMT

Which weapon are we banning again?

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Willy Truth — Thu, 20 Dec 2012 23:25:04 GMT

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn17922-carrying-a-gun-increases-risk-of-getting-shot-and-killed.html?full=true&print=true

CARRYING A GUN CAN & WILL KILL YOU

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Thisprogramhasnotbeenrated — Wed, 19 Dec 2012 07:57:43 GMT

Morgan Freeman, for a Hollywood type, seemed quite sensible on the matter.

No way, you must have confused him with Thomas Sowell.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Torsten — Mon, 17 Dec 2012 12:57:26 GMT

Welp, another massacre. This one, as you all know, is of a particularly heinous nature because the children are involved. Horrible, horrible stuff.

Just like in the Waco massacre, there were children involved, too. Was the AFT disarmed for that?

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Jon Irenicus — Mon, 17 Dec 2012 00:24:52 GMT

Amusingly, they will claim the UK has no record of school gun shootings. There's a lot of control freaks out there, sadly.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Wheylous — Mon, 17 Dec 2012 00:03:45 GMT

xahrx

Those are from the entire campaign

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

fountainhead — Mon, 17 Dec 2012 00:03:44 GMT

@Cortes

The increase in UK gun violence after their firearm ban is an argument I've heard from various places in debating the gun control issue. Here are a couple of examples:

Gun politics in the United Kingdom - Near complete ban of privately-owned firearms goes into effect in 1997

Culture of violence: Gun crime goes up by 89% in a decade - From 1998/1999 to 2009

I agree that stats can be easily manipulated but I think the UK presents at least a good counter-example to show that a ban on private ownership of firearms doesn't necessarily decrease gun violence. Switzerland too, on the opposite end.

I guess my main feeling is that it's a complex issue and I'm tired of everyone claiming they have the perfect solution after every shooting that occurs.

Re: Guns Want You DEAD

Jon Irenicus — Sun, 16 Dec 2012 23:49:13 GMT

FWIW, they will argue no one should be able to own a gun if you point out this guy got it from his mother. I think the swimming pool comment pretty much eviscerates their proposed rationale, however, unless they plan on being stubbornly illogical. In which case they only make themselves look stupid.