It was bound to happen sooner or later.
The bill, with 308 co-sponsors, has been stripped of provisions that would remove Fed exemptions from audits of transactions with foreign central banks, monetary policy deliberations, transactions made under the direction of the Federal Open Market Committee and communications between the Board, the reserve banks and staff, Paul said today.
The situation was a win win proposition from the start. No matter what they did, the FED was screwed. This shows the system can in no way be reformed. Actions like this will further push "limited government" folk and others into favoring the complete abolition of the state. Or at least completely adopt the argument from morality.
Capital Pumper: The bill, with 308 co-sponsors, has been stripped of provisions that would remove Fed exemptions from audits of transactions with foreign central banks, monetary policy deliberations, transactions made under the direction of the Federal Open Market Committee and communications between the Board, the reserve banks and staff, Paul said today.
Democracy in action.
I don't understand how the bill was removed of provisions. Can someone please help me understand how that happens?
This may have an upside.
For a moment there, it seemed to many of the Ron Paul supporters that Democracy can actually work. Maybe this will teach them a lesson.
Perhaps this outcome is more valuable to the freedom cause then the original bill actually passing.
I think Ron Paul knew this would happened anyway. Maybe he's really that sophisticated and simply wanted to teach his supporters this lesson also.
Unfortunately, true reform may only rise from the ashes.
Completely expected. What an enormous waste of time and money pushing this bill.
If you find something evil that wobbles, push it. - Gary North
liberty student:Completely expected. What an enormous waste of time and money pushing this bill.
Very dis-hearting but I don't know if it was a complete waste yet. The web hit-count of the mises site and RP site should give us the impression that all our endeavorer are at least getting us attention. I'm sorry LS, and everyone else. :(
Statism is a religion.
filc:Very dis-hearting but I don't know if it was a complete waste yet.
You can't reform the system with the system. I know people try hard, but they don't understand the incentives of politicians. Of course they were going to block this. They have blocked stuff like this before. Bernanke was not sweating it.
filc:The web hit-count of the mises site and RP site should give us the impression that all our endeavorer are at least getting us attention.
Well, ideas like yours, educational ideas deserve attention. Convincing people that they can control Washington through phone calls and petitions was misguided at best.
filc:I'm sorry LS, and everyone else. :(
No need to be sorry. This is a learning experience for many people. There are no shortcuts. There is no magic bill or politician who will change things. Change has to come slowly and progressively. It has to be individual to individual.
liberty student: Completely expected. What an enormous waste of time and money pushing this bill.
Wow! You would have been banned for life from RPFs for saying that.
My favorite online shop: www.cafepress.com/libertyphile
DD5: Maybe this will teach them a lesson.
If they haven't learnt already, then cognitive dissonance has got in the way. That goes for online supporters anyway. At Daily Paul they have learnt, the site owner Michael Nyrostorm is an anarcho-capitalist from what I know... and essentially every single blogger (on the front page) is too.
Over at RPF, the majority were and have. A few mods ruined it due to their ignorance... but the amusing thing is - the more they promote Ron Paul, the greater the likelihood more people are going to discover the LvMI, and then anarcho-capitalism... so they can't escape it.
DD5:Perhaps this outcome is more valuable to the freedom cause then the original bill actually passing.
I dunno about that. lol. Seeing who got given the billions and an audit would have gone a long way to destroying the Fed's credibility. But yeah, win win - the banksters own the political parasites. This makes it even clearer - if that was at all possible.
DD5:I think Ron Paul knew this would happened anyway. Maybe he's really that sophisticated and simply wanted to teach his supporters this lesson also.
He is subtle like that. Imo, should he run again for President [Run against the presidency as it is currently understood], and I see absolutely no reason why he wouldn't as age plays absolutely no factor [All he has to do is stand up and talk], although I am sure the MSM will try bring it up because they have practically NOTHING on him. Unless they want to try throw out what they did last time - racism / conspiracy / kook / etc..
However, the debates will be different this time. The republicans are not in power and the war is not a massive issue. The Republicans will be using Libertarian talking points like you wouldn't believe.
Ron is going to have to differentiate himself by either calling them all out, or, by being more radical. And since it will be his last 'shot' hopefully he will be, although I am unsure how he actually would be.. without explicitly stating it. Haha. Regardless though, he will garner more acceptance of Libertarianism in the public sphere.
Of course it was just a matter of time but Ron knew that, lol. I don't think it was a complete waste. He did get some hearings on the issue... Mr Woods going to Washington to testify. Hehe.
I'm a newb when it comes to the process, but can't he just make another HR 1207? (with a different number of course)
The appeal to "charity" is a truly ironic one. First, it is hardly "charity" to take wealth by force and hand it over to someone else. -Rothbard
Conza88:Of course it was just a matter of time but Ron knew that, lol. I don't think it was a complete waste.
I wrote enormous waste of time and money.
Is it a complete waste? No. But a poor use of resources IMO.
Conza88:He did get some hearings on the issue... Mr Woods going to Washington to testify.
That's like getting our joy from Ron Paul interviews on YT during the campaign. It didn't add up to anything but our own thrills.
I'm past the "this liberty thing is really fun and exciting" point. I'm interested in making meaningful contributions that have long lasting effects.
Sad reading some of the comments on RPF. I wouldn't go there, but I since we've talked about it recently, I felt the need. Same sort of stuff I saw after Ron got crushed in NH.
liberty student:Convincing people that they can control Washington through phone calls and petitions was misguided at best.
liberty student:You can't reform the system with the system.
Thats true. I think that is perhaps the hardest thing to learn.
filc:Thats true. I think that is perhaps the hardest thing to learn
Well in a sense Liberty is right and I think in another he is too cynical. Are pieces like the Audit the Fed worthless? I would say no. I think it presented a roadblock [ that of course was overcome ] but a roadblock none the less. Pieces such as these at least show what libertarians aim for though it probably won't go through. It is a declaration to the citizenry saying 'We think this is wrong and this is why.' I think silent waiting or speaking of libertarianism at social events which perhaps is an effective system for the grassroots but I don't think libertarianism is really just dinner conversation. True we have seminars but the general populace are usually to inclined to their immediate area. I think the Audit the Fed piece was really thrown into the lime light, and this is not something that often happens. So I find it bittersweet. Perhaps more bitter then Ron Paul fans, but sweeter then the cynic who thinks this was an utter waste of time.
'It is difficult to imagine any normal person wishing to meet Marx for a third time.' - Alexander Gray, The Socialist Tradition
Another post that doesn't address my criticism. It was a waste of time and resources. And it was. An enormous waste.
Laughing Man:It is a declaration to the citizenry saying 'We think this is wrong and this is why.'
No, it is a declaration to the citizenry that we think the government is legitimate, and if we can just get the right people in, then we can have liberty.
Laughing Man:I think silent waiting or speaking of libertarianism at social events which perhaps is an effective system for the grassroots but I don't think libertarianism is really just dinner conversation.
Some of us actually do things and don't advertise it. No one is suggesting being silent. Simply being radical and honest.
Laughing Man:but sweeter then the cynic who thinks this was an utter waste of time.
The only good thing about it, is that it failed. It will disillusion people who think politicians will listen to them. That if you phone your congressman enough, he will vote your way against the most powerful special interest in the world.
The history of the FED vs. Congressional review is longer than the last year. It goes back decades. Tom DiLorenzo has written about it on LRC. I don't think anyone in the austro-libertarian hierarchy expected this to go any further, and it didnt. You'll notice, LvMI and LRC don't promote C4L causes. There is a reason for that. We're not reformists.
liberty student:Another post that doesn't address my criticism. It was a waste of time and resources. And it was. An enormous waste.
Well why do you see it as a waste?
liberty student:No, it is a declaration to the citizenry that we think the government is legitimate, and if we can just get the right people in, then we can have liberty.
Well I don't think the audit the fed bill was trying to strategically place anyone in the government.
liberty student:Some of us actually do things and don't advertise it. No one is suggesting being silent. Simply being radical and honest.
Well I think some people think its is an effective way. I'm on the fence about it. I don't see it as a waste of time but I wonder as to how effect they think it will actually be.
liberty student:The only good thing about it, is that it failed. It will disillusion people who think politicians will listen to them. That if you phone your congressman enough, he will vote your way against the most powerful special interest in the world.
See what I mean, absolute cynic. It at least inspired people that something was being done however brief the case. There are some who cannot just sit around like good little soldiers waiting for the right moment for someone to say 'Ok now!' This was action. This was a step, a very small step, but a step. This was a beneficial step. In my heart of hearts I wish it would of worked out. I was skeptical but not cynical.
liberty student:I don't think anyone in the austro-libertarian hierarchy expected this to go any further, and it didnt. You'll notice, LvMI and LRC don't promote C4L causes. There is a reason for that. We're not reformists.
This is an absolutely ridiculous statement and you should know this. What does Thomas Woods do? How often is Ron Paul's name invoked in the LvMi lectures calling him the only honorable politician. I'm not a Ron Paul fan anymore but I obviously see the absurdity in you claiming that Ron Paul goes unspoken. The LvMi sells all of Ron Paul's books and even put his new work in the 'End the Fed' collection. The LRC has podcasts of Ron Paul for god's sake, he even has a column. Granted this is not the C4L, obviously. However, you seem to be implicitly trying to alienate them from the LvMi for what I conceive to be as faulty reasons.
I would rather see the fed dismantled through congress than not dismantled at all... One way to prove Ancap-ism is to dismantle the state and show how things get better with every progressive step. This is just one way though, it may have many problems.
"It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes. But the half-wit remains a half-wit and the emperor remains an emperor." ~Dream
Snowflake: I would rather see the fed dismantled through congress than not dismantled at all... One way to prove Ancap-ism is to dismantle the state and show how things get better with every progressive step. This is just one way though, it may have many problems.
I'd rather have anything dismantled then not dismantled at all. Is the government likely to do it? No. But would I say 'if you can't do it my way then I don't want it at all'? Of course not.
And Jeffrey Tucker's article on Halloween free-markets is right on the front page of campaign for liberty.
Just something to point out: The federal reserve/banking industry in the states is insanely complex, though it need not necessarily be dismantled from within. All that needs to happen is to legalize free currency; make it possible for people to pay and get paid in whatever they choose. In this way, everyone would stop trading in dollars and the system would collapse.
I wish ron paul would just push for this. You dont need to defeat elaborate arguments made by central bankers and keynesian economists. Just... free currency
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