Economics Questions

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Padishah — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 19:00:12 GMT

Telpeurion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7QDv4sYwjO0

The statist answer to Somalia.

There has been slight material improvement in some areas of Somalia, sure. Great improvement where unitary state coercion and domination of individual lives is concerned, definitely. However, the guys in this video just show monumental ignorance where they say that Somalia has no functioning government. There have been functioning governments who've taxed, exert territorial monopoly on the use of legal force, exchanged embassies with foreign governments and all the rest.

In fact, the current State President of Puntland used to be my neighbour.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

alerty — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 18:22:35 GMT

I bought a pizza yesterday. Me and the guy who sold the pizza were happy with the transaction. I don`t know what you mean with quantifiable example, maybe 1 happy costumer, 1 happy businessman, 1 pizza and R$30,00?

I saw another post of yours saying that capitalism failed in South America. I'm from South America and i'm curious why you think that.

And about you saying that the financial crisis is a failure of capitalism, is your argument just based on this reasoning? "Everyone knows the United States is a totally capitalist country and there was a financial crisis in the United States, so capitalism has failed".

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Daniel — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 07:15:33 GMT

When you say "capitalism", do you mean free-market capitalism, or do you mean mercantilism?

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

AJ — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 07:02:48 GMT

For quantitative and tangible, you'll have the problem than every economy these days is a mixed economy, so we cannot fully separate out the effects of capitalism and socialism. However, the effects of capitalism are easy to see in the simple economic scenario, like on a desert island. Take a look at his comic book presentation:

http://www.restoretherepublic.org/documents/how-an-economy-grows.pdf

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

nazgulnarsil — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 06:34:53 GMT

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracle_of_Chile

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

AJ — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 04:40:10 GMT

Markus:
Therefore, where are all these examples of capitalism actually working? Merely saying, for example, that capitalism has lifted millions of people out of poverty or increased living standards is rather tenuous and vague. Are there any clear and quantifiable examples of where, and how, capitalism has worked?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRhtmcxDSIs#t=14m55s (Tom Woods on robber barons, big business, capitalism, and exploitation in American history)

And an easy example in most of the 1800s in the US. Living standards skyrocketed, as I'm sure you know. I've already told you, you need to watch your definitions. When we talk of capitalism, we are simply talking of "a system with no restrictions on the voluntary exchange of goods and services." There has been no capitalism by this definition in Africa and Central America, and the financial crisis was caused, and is being perpetuated, by government intervention. Once you have government intervention, you no longer have pure capitalism, hence businesses are no longer pure businesses. You're arguing as if Goldman Sachs being a culprit in the financial crisis is grounds for denouncing capitalism, but Goldman Sachs is so in bed with the government it's not even funny.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

laminustacitus — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 03:43:05 GMT

Markus:
Are there any clear and quantifiable examples of where, and how, capitalism has worked?

Has there once been a famine in a capitalistic society?

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Fluery — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 02:11:33 GMT

Markus, do you understand the difference between socialism and capitalism?

That said I'm mostly posting so I can check out some good historical examples later.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Vitor — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 01:00:00 GMT

Just look at yourself. You were able to afford a little machine that is able to do billions of calculations per second whose components are fabricated in a nano scale and that lets you come here to complain about capitalism instead of having to hunt for food. So yeah, I guess capitalism works.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Esuric — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 00:51:06 GMT

You might as well ask for tangible and quantifiable research which proves that freedom "works." Capitalism cannot fail; it's the only natural economic system, which emerges through willful human interaction, through the use of markets. Whenever people are coerced, whenever the markets are meddled with, it ceases to truly be considered capitalism. What you call the "failure of capitalism" is really just the failure of socialistic institutions which have infiltrated our economic system. Socialism is not an economic theory; it's a non-theory, for people who don't understand the natural market process of real economics. The economy consists of 6 billion+ individuals who make thousands of choices everyday; trying to influence their choices, through coercion, has countless unseen negative ramifications. This is what you're observing.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Taras Smereka — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 00:42:47 GMT

scineram:

My cell, plasma, laptop, air conditioner work just fine.

same

the private gym I go to is nice too, but the government road i take there is always pretty shitty

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Praetyre — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 00:22:13 GMT

Private ownership of the means of production has little to do with the current financial crisis. It has been caused by the policies of the United States Federal Reserve and similar central banking institutions in other countries. There are also many varieties of capitalism, so you'll have to be specific about which you are criticizing, considering the fairly vast differences between European capitalism, American capitalism, Chinese capitalism, laissez-faire capitalism, Monetarism, Keynesianism and the like.

On your specific areas: It's debatable whether the USA is capitalist or not; I'd argue there's a third category between government and private that suits quasi-private entities like Nazi-era Volkswagen, modern General Motors, the British East India Company and the like, entities which are heavily controlled and/or in bed with the government, though I'm not precisely sure what % of the means of the production are owned by those pseudo-private entities. No idea what you are on about with Africa, since last time I checked, Zimbabwe, one of the worst off nations in Africa (with utterly absurd inflation and a 94% unemployment rate), was run by a Marxist. No idea what you are referring to in Central America, either, considering it seems to be communist and fascist terrorists who are causing a lot of internal problems for these countries at the moment, as well as the American "War on Drugs".

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Telpeurion — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 00:21:28 GMT

Nerditarian:

Markus:
Capitalism has failed in Africa and Central America

No it hasn't you ignore the extent to which there is socialistic and collectivistic regimes in these places. Compare communist Somalia with free Somalia.

Markus:

failed in the Western world too with this financial crisis.

LMFAO. No it has not. We do not have capitalism. Repeat, we do not have capitalism. We have a fascistic collectivism. It was the progressive institution of the Federal Reserve that failed, not the market

Markus:
Therefore, where are all these examples of capitalism actually working?

Taiwan? Singapore? England in the Industrial revolution? Modern Somalia to an extent?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7QDv4sYwjO0

The statist answer to Somalia.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

scineram — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 00:15:18 GMT

My cell, plasma, laptop, air conditioner work just fine.

Re: Tangible and quantifiable examples of capitalism working, if any?

Felipe — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 23:15:57 GMT

Markus:
Capitalism has failed in Africa and Central America

I would like to know what do you understand by "Central America", if by it you mean Venezuela or Ecuador, capitalism didnt fail there, the republican institutions in those countries failed to the people by allowing the rise of mentaly unstable totalitarian socialist leaders like Chavez and Ortega.