Have you heard? They've been saying it since before it began but now it's official! Just check out these statistics!
Buyers of gold do not seem to agree. If the economy was eveng showing real recovery vs paper recovery there buyers of gold would not be so desperate to get it. Why? Because at some point all this money generated by the WORLD central banks, the US in particular, will move from bank reservers into loans. When this happens prices are sure to go up. The central banks have two choices:
1. Keep the money creation going and entice banks not to lend money. This way failed banks will have paper reserves to pay depositors and sustain business, we call these Zombie Banks. This is 1990s Japan in a nut shell. The Japanese almost broke out of this in 2006 to 2006 time frame, but were smoted back when the economy in the USA went into the current recession.
2. Stop or slow the money creation by increasing interest rates. This will quickly separate the bad banks from the good ones and slow already slow lending. In other words it will turn the recession into a depression. Consumers will divert savings to federal loans away from equities and gold. The federal and state and local governments will feel an instant credit crunch and will not be able to continue their destructive growth. The silver lining in this is that consumers will save more and once the new paper is out of the system will move their investments from federal bonds back to other investments.
Which option do you thing the Federal Government and Central Banks will take? Japan took #1. Bad move.
Interesting. Though I have a couple questions.Is there any reason for the diversion of savings into federal loans and away from gold and equities? Deflation? What is the worth in a federal bond anyway?
The National Bureau of Economic Research determines when the recession is officially over, not MSNBC.com or Economy.com. NBER doesn't decide that a recession is over until it has several months of data beyond the date that they declare it was over. This article is just another example of someone seeing "green shoots" (and possibly hallucinating).
If it's over then why Harley Davidson is shutting down Buell to save money? Sorry, that's my line of work so that's what I know the best...
Why there are more unemployed and less lorries on the road?
Yes, it's time for the Dr Goebbels show!
Kakugo:Why there are more unemployed and less lorries on the road?
"It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes. But the half-wit remains a half-wit and the emperor remains an emperor." ~Dream
Just read that article. It's a joke. Many of the non-recession places are just government centers. And not one county in the country is showing an actual expansion, as the article notes near the end. It's like a hoax.
The coyote catches a tree limb sticking off a cliff and MSNBC celebrates that he is no longer falling.
Jeffrey TuckerEditorial VP, Mises
jtucker: Just read that article. It's a joke. Many of the non-recession places are just government centers. And not one county in the country is showing an actual expansion, as the article notes near the end. It's like a hoax. The coyote catches a tree limb sticking off a cliff and MSNBC celebrates that he is no longer falling.
And the dust that causes the coyote to run off said cliff is the malinvestment. Cartoon analogies, still useful!
'It is difficult to imagine any normal person wishing to meet Marx for a third time.' - Alexander Gray, The Socialist Tradition
Snowflake: On that note: what will america look like in 10 years?
All the statists and Keynesians will look up and shout "Save Us!" and I'll wisper "No."
That good huh?At least in 10 years America will have a plethora of diverse content with satisfying character development and impressive graphics. Oh wait no it won't.
(Can bethesda make a game that isn't vanilla? When piranha bytes has a staff of 47 and puts out a game like risen you know you're doing something wrong)
Right back to economics: I think there will be a recovery in time for the house elections to keep the democrats in power a little while longer. This thing is going to probably last 5 years if the fed keeps up. I wouldn't be surprised if it lasted for 10. We'll be crippled forever. The ongoing wars in the middle east can't help... They aren't ever going to get out of there. Obama is prepping the military to deal with "irregular" (aka constant) wars fought in other countries.The only chance we have at prosperity is technology, which is sad. Just plug your brain directly into the internet and surf to your heart's content.
Snowflake: That good huh?At least in 10 years America will have a plethora of diverse content with satisfying character development and impressive graphics. Oh wait no it won't. (Can bethesda make a game that isn't vanilla? When piranha bytes has a staff of 47 and puts out a game like risen you know you're doing something wrong)
Hey at least there will finally be somthing decent on the radio. What's Risen I've never heard of it.
Snowflake: Right back to economics: I think there will be a recovery in time for the house elections to keep the democrats in power a little while longer. This thing is going to probably last 5 years if the fed keeps up. I wouldn't be surprised if it lasted for 10. We'll be crippled forever. The ongoing wars in the middle east can't help... They aren't ever going to get out of there. Obama is prepping the military to deal with "irregular" (aka constant) wars fought in other countries.
Right back to economics: I think there will be a recovery in time for the house elections to keep the democrats in power a little while longer. This thing is going to probably last 5 years if the fed keeps up. I wouldn't be surprised if it lasted for 10. We'll be crippled forever. The ongoing wars in the middle east can't help... They aren't ever going to get out of there. Obama is prepping the military to deal with "irregular" (aka constant) wars fought in other countries.
Sounds about right... I dunno with the deficit reaching such huge skyscraping heights, and I can't imagine the economy will will be "good", and the obvious bullshit of this amazing "Change" that we're experiencing I wouldn't count out the fair chance of a rise in libertarianism and particularly mincarchism that might somhow turn things around.
Snowflake: The only chance we have at prosperity is technology, which is sad. Just plug your brain directly into the internet and surf to your heart's content.
Won't change anything, it'll just collapse everything faster as the market tries to just to adjust to the new "internet world" through a recession that will finally kill us because or economy which by then will exist only as a house of cards will crumble.
There are alot of possibilities out there. None of them look good. One of my greatest hopes that is likley to happen is that we will be able to resurect somthing out of the ashes... Oh and if you know the story behind my user name and another video game refrence
http://www.psu.com/media/wallpapers/welcome-to-rapture.jpg
Well, I do not live in the US but I do live in a manufacturing area and my observations are based on what i see each and every day. Even the local newspapers are giving up on the task of presenting a booming recovery. Three days ago they carried the news that all the main steel mills in the area have agreed to massive lay offs, anything between 20 and 48% of the workforce. Yesterday they carried a touchy letter signed by hundreds of small enterprises owners denouncing the mindless optimism displayed by the EU and the Italian government in this months: in short they were asking "where's the recovery everybody's talking about?". There was also a contradictory piece by the governor of the Central Bank stating in short "yes we are out of it, go out and spend, spend, spend" but immediately after saying "we lost 500.000 jobs ever since the recovery started in July". He offered no explanation why the economy is better by the day yet people are losing their jobs at an unprecedented pace.
Next year will be like nothing seen in recent history: soaring GDPs around the world with soaring unemployment everywhere. The most alarming part of this is that nobody and let me tell you, nobody, is asking the simple question "if the economy's so much better why are we still firing people?".
The Late Andrew Ryan: Snowflake: On that note: what will america look like in 10 years?
Interesting game. I like the Alaska campaign.
I'm more optimistic.
The story begins and ends in Los Angeles, which is no longer part of what is left of the United States during the early 21st century. In this hypothetical future reality the federal government of the United States has ceded most of its power to private organizations and entrepreneurs.[3] Franchising, individual sovereignty and automobiles reign supreme (along with drug trafficking, violent crime, and traffic congestion). Mercenary armies compete for national defense contracts while private security guards preserve the peace in gated, sovereign housing developments. Highway companies compete to attract drivers to their roads rather than the competitors', and all mail delivery is by hired courier. The remnants of government maintain authority only in isolated compounds where they transact tedious make-work that is, by and large, irrelevant to the booming, dynamic society around them.
Much of the territory ceded by the government has been carved up into sovereign enclaves, each run by its own big business franchise (such as "Mr. Lee's Greater Hong Kong") or the various residential burbclaves (suburban enclaves). This arrangement resembles anarcho-capitalism, a theme Stephenson carries over to his next novel The Diamond Age. Hyperinflation has devalued the dollar to the extent that trillion dollar bills — Ed Meeses — are nearly disregarded and the quadrillion dollar note — the Gipper — is the standard 'small' bill. For physical transactions people resort to alternative, non-hyperinflated currencies such as yen or "Kongbucks" (the official currency of Mr. Lee's Greater Hong Kong).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snow_crash
Microsecession as a strategy for revolution | Challenge to minarchist | How would a private road system work?
Much of the territory ceded by the government has been carved up into sovereign enclaves, each run by its own big business franchise
February 17 - 1600 - Giordano Bruno is burnt alive by the catholic church. Aquinas : "much more reason is there for heretics, as soon as they are convicted of heresy, to be not only excommunicated but even put to death."
Juan:Sounds like a bad caricature of libertarianism.
Not as bad as some of the caricatures seen online.
Juan:By the way, isn't a 'sovereign' (wtf) monopolistic 'enclave' the definition of a state?
No.
Juan:And these 'sovereign' enclaves have been 'franchised' by...whom exactly ?
Mr. Lee.
If you find something evil that wobbles, push it. - Gary North
Juan:Much of the territory ceded by the government has been carved up into sovereign enclaves, each run by its own big business franchise Sounds like a bad caricature of libertarianism. By the way, isn't a 'sovereign' (wtf) monopolistic 'enclave' the definition of a state? And these 'sovereign' enclaves have been 'franchised' by...whom exactly ?
Nobody said the future wouldn't be a caricature.
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