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<?xml-stylesheet type="text/xsl" href="http://mises.org/Community/utility/FeedStylesheets/rss.xsl" media="screen"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:slash="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/slash/" xmlns:wfw="http://wellformedweb.org/CommentAPI/"><channel><title>Copyfascism Watch : eula</title><link>http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/tags/eula/default.aspx</link><description>Tags: eula</description><dc:language>en</dc:language><generator>CommunityServer 2008.5 SP2 (Build: 40407.4157)</generator><item><title>The Validity of End User License Agreements Redux</title><link>http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/2008/12/02/the-validity-of-end-user-license-agreements-redux.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 16:38:00 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:68371</guid><dc:creator>aheram</dc:creator><slash:comments>4</slash:comments><comments>http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/2008/12/02/the-validity-of-end-user-license-agreements-redux.aspx#comments</comments><description>&lt;p&gt;I have been reading &lt;a href="http://techliberation.com/"&gt;The Technology Liberation Front&lt;/a&gt; (libertarians critiquing developments in the fields of the internet and technology) and came across Tim Lee&amp;#39;s repost of the &lt;a href="http://xkcd.com/"&gt;popular webcomic XKCD&lt;/a&gt; regarding End-User License Agreements (EULA) with a question, &amp;quot;&lt;a href="http://techliberation.com/2008/11/07/more-on-shrink-wrap-contracts/"&gt;Legally enforceable?&lt;/a&gt;&amp;quot;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/apr/24/law.software?gusrc=rss&amp;amp;feed=technology"&gt;Wendy Grossman&lt;/a&gt; explained the legal gray area that surrounds every EULA software companies use for their softwares:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;If you did read the terms, you might be surprised. Eulas typically
specify that the software&amp;#39;s publisher is not liable if anything goes
wrong. They typically specify the publisher&amp;#39;s preferred jurisdiction
for legal disputes. And some are even more restrictive: some graphics
packages have been known to specify that they cannot be used in the
production of pornographic images. Yet these licences are, as Hanlon
complained, not really contracts: you generally cannot read them before
you buy (rather than use) the software, and you can&amp;#39;t negotiate terms.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I have tackled the question before in &lt;i&gt;Copyfascism Watch&lt;/i&gt;, &lt;a href="http://mises.org/Community/controlpanel/blogs/copyfascism/archive/2008/05/05/eulas-in-the-united-kingdom.aspx"&gt;where I raised another point&lt;/a&gt;
that EULAs are not voluntary contracts as they are not agreed upon
prior to the purchase of the software. And there is the bizarre claim
by manufacturers that consumers are merely purchasing the physical CDs
and not the software it contains. I asked, &amp;quot;How legitimate are the
claims of
manufacturers that consumers are merely buying the CDs and not the
permission to install and use the software for which the consumer
(rightly, I might add) believed he is paying?&amp;quot;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Jeffrey Tucker of the Mises Blog responded:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;[R]estrictive covenants do this all the time with houses for example. You
buy the house in a particular neighborhood and it is really yours, but
you can&amp;#39;t paint your shutters pink and you have to mow your grass and
can&amp;#39;t leave a sofa on the porch etc. Why can&amp;#39;t EULAs amount to a sort
of covenant?&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In the Mises Blog, Tucker also asked this question, &amp;quot;&lt;a href="http://blog.mises.org/archives/008087.asp"&gt;Are EULAs contrary to property rights?&lt;/a&gt;&amp;quot;
Tucker seems to be of notion that is similar to a covenant, but therein
lies the issue and the difference between physical property covenants
and EULAs: covenants are known and agreed upon prior to purchase, EULAs
are hidden contracts that is then revealed to you after the purchase.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;A commenter named PR &lt;a href="http://blog.mises.org/archives/008087.asp#comment-256835"&gt;raised the same point&lt;/a&gt;:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;Since the EULA isn&amp;#39;t revealed until after the buyer has handed over his
money, of course it shouldn&amp;#39;t be considered a valid agreement. All the
examples of convenants I know of are presented to the buyer before the
sale, but a EULA is more like a legal Trojan horse that restricts the
use of property one already owns.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Many
of the responses seem to miss that point and the important issue
regarding this unconscionable agreements: it is secret, it is hidden,
and cannot be agreed to prior to purchase. A commenter pointed out that
you can always return the software, but most stores I purchase software
from only have a return-policy for unopened boxes of software. Of
course, one can argue that one can choose not to patronize the store
that has taken one&amp;#39;s money for a software crippled by an agreement one
cannot agree to prior to purchase and afterwards, but since when do
libertarians make excuses for theft?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;Cross-posted to &lt;a href="http://redstateeclectic.typepad.com/redstate_commentary/"&gt;Red State Eclectic&lt;/a&gt;.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;img src="http://mises.org/Community/aggbug.aspx?PostID=68371" width="1" height="1"&gt;</description><category domain="http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/tags/eula/default.aspx">eula</category></item><item><title>The Validity of End User License Agreements</title><link>http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/2008/05/05/eulas-in-the-united-kingdom.aspx</link><pubDate>Sun, 04 May 2008 23:27:00 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:30809</guid><dc:creator>aheram</dc:creator><slash:comments>11</slash:comments><comments>http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/2008/05/05/eulas-in-the-united-kingdom.aspx#comments</comments><description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2008/apr/24/law.software?gusrc=rss&amp;amp;feed=technology"&gt;Wendy Grossman&lt;/a&gt; explains the legal gray area that surrounds End-User License Agreements (EULA) that Microsoft et al slaps on every piece of software it sells to consumers:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;If you did read the terms, you might be surprised. Eulas typically
specify that the software&amp;#39;s publisher is not liable if anything goes
wrong. They typically specify the publisher&amp;#39;s preferred jurisdiction
for legal disputes. And some are even more restrictive: some graphics
packages have been known to specify that they cannot be used in the
production of pornographic images. Yet these licences are, as Hanlon
complained, not really contracts: you generally cannot read them before
you buy (rather than use) the software, and you can&amp;#39;t negotiate terms.&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;One of the problems that needs to be resolved in the copyfight is the validity of licenses, which not only includes all EULAs, but Creative Commons and open-source licenses like the GNU as well. An argument cannot be made that the consumer and seller participated in a voluntary-exchange, when often the terms of the EULA are not agreed to prior to the purchase. How legitimate are the claims of manufacturers that consumers are merely buying the CDs and not the permission to install and use the software for which the consumer (rightly, I might add) believed he is paying?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;We do not accept that Ford or American Eagle (a clothing company) has any say in how we use the products they sell us after it is sold to us. Why then do we give software companies this right?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;img src="http://mises.org/Community/aggbug.aspx?PostID=30809" width="1" height="1"&gt;</description><category domain="http://mises.org/Community/blogs/copyfascism/archive/tags/eula/default.aspx">eula</category></item></channel></rss>