The Anarcho-Statists

re: The Anarcho-Statists

Brainpolice — Tue, 22 Apr 2008 02:52:16 GMT

It's many of the anarcho-syndicalists in particular who bother me. I can say that at least from personal experience that I've tried to extend the olive branch and build bridges to them but they often just spit in my face. They even seem hostile to mutualism and individualist anarchism.

And sometimes I suspect that their global federation of unions would function as a state in practise. Furthermore, the phrase they often use about decision-making in portion to the degree that one is effected by something seems very vague to me, as anyone could concievably arbitratilary claim to be effected by something, directly or indirectly.

re: The Anarcho-Statists

William — Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:59:51 GMT

Next to no Social Anarchists support Chavez and Castro. To give you a sense of proportionality it's a far, far smaller percent than Market Anarchists who think Somalia is Utopia.

I agree more or less with your points. But, while annoying tendencies they have, I don't think most of the folks you're referring to are so far gone as to deserve the anarcho-"statist" moniker.

Those who haven't already should damn well ditch Marx, but that doesn't mean ignoring the self-conscious creation of existing class lines. When a social anarchist declares that the working class are being exploited and that she'd love to take a shotgun to the super-rich because they're all murdering thieves in bed wit the cops, I'm not going to bother quibbling. She's got it close enough.

re: The Anarcho-Statists

Brainpolice — Mon, 21 Apr 2008 00:26:17 GMT

You're right that Carson's concept of "vulgar libertarianism" does not describe people who oppose the welfare state and economic intervention in general. It's supposed to describe those who defend currently existing conditions and corporations for their own sake as if they came about from a free market processes when they did not, those who are pro-big-buisiness for its own sake divorced from context, etc.

It really depends on which social anarchists. I've met some who are quite reasonable and even not that far off from my own position. But the anarcho-syndicalists and anarcho-communists in particular who I've encountered have all been irrationally hostile, insist on inevitable conflict, bash all market oriented anarchism and deny that it is really anarchism. These same people then go on to defend state-socialism without even realizing it.

re: The Anarcho-Statists

Cork — Sun, 20 Apr 2008 19:18:35 GMT

I've noticed that quite a few "social anarchists" totally misunderstand and misuse the phrase "vulgar libertarianism." They use the phrase to describe anyone who wants to cut welfare programs and government regulation (which was never Carson's point at all).

Most "social anarchists" are even bigger statists than the average joe. A disturbing number of them support Hugo Chavez and Fidel Castro (any blood-soaked dictator who comes along, basically).